Mel’s Building a Business That Doesn’t Need Her

Curt, it's been crazy here. It's rainy season, flooding every day, and people in the city, especially in Manila, this is where most of my time has been spent. When I went to visit my friend Courtney at her agency, what should have been a 20-minute trip turned into 2 hours because of traffic just in the rain. And my meeting was supposed to be at 11 and I got there, I think at midnight because we're on nighttime, you know, the nighttime, which was also weird to go to a business meeting at midnight. And then I got home at like 4:30 in the morning and it took me 20 minutes to get home. So it's just crazy how much traffic plays into people's lives here too. Flooding. I mean, have you ever had one of your employees say, I can't work because my house is flooded?

Welcome to the Soul Proprietor Podcast. I'm Curt Kempton.

And I'm Melody Edwards.

Each week we dive into the ethical questions that keep entrepreneurs awake at night.

Whether you're building your own company or exploring life's big questions, you Are welcome here.

Hello, Melody.

Kumusta, Curt? It does sound Spanish. Kumusta, Curt?

I happen to know that wasn't Spanish. That was you being an international Tagalog speaker, was it not?

Yeah, I was trying to speak one word of Tagalog.

And I would speak one word back.

Hi.

Ante?

Ate?

Ate? Dang it, I got it wrong.

I hear this word every single day, all the time, and I still mix it with other languages. It's very hard for me to keep all of this together, but it is very Spanishy, this language of Tagalog. So yeah, I'm in the Philippines, Curt.

That is so cool. Are you having any fun?

I am, but I came during rainy season. I cannot tell you how many monsoons and typhoons, like I have checked the box off of my bucket list of things that I want to experience in life, which was monsoon typhoon. I have experienced so many of them and I've been here about 3 weeks and it has rained every day, sometimes buckets. It floods all the time and traffic in Manila is insane. I didn't understand because I've been in traffic before, but not like that. It can change in an instant. You know, a 10-minute ride can become 2 hours in like minutes.

Oh yeah. Yeah. I honestly felt even in Cebu, which my understanding is it's much better traffic in Cebu than it is in Manila, but I would honestly feel like who's driving right now? Like a bicycle or feet are far faster and safer. Well, I say safer. I felt very unsafe riding in Cebu because of how close and how little they care about lines. They just get right next to each other. Although I never once witnessed a crash.

No, honestly, I enjoy it very much because if I could, that's how I would drive. I think lines are silly. The man created the lines and I don't want to follow the rules.

I don't know why they bother painting them because they do paint the lines, but then they proceed to completely ignore them.

And I had this experience in Morocco as well. They really have their own system of driving and everybody knows what it is except for the newbies. And so we come in, so I've driven in other countries where it's chaos and the first couple of days are really hard. And then I'm driving in the chaos and it's like, it's just normal.

I just don't know how they're like gauging it because like when 2 cars are exactly one car width apart plus a millimeter, they just like casually are like, oh yeah, that's the right size. And they go through it like nothing and they don't really slow down for it.

It's a dance. They know what they're doing. They've trained their whole life for it. But I haven't been able to drive on a motorcycle yet, although a guy offered me to taxi me on a motorcycle in the rain tonight.

Have you been able to do the, uh, jeepney yet?

No, the jeepney has been on my list all 3 trips, and I have till tomorrow to get it done this trip. But I did take a lot of tuk-tuks when I went to Bohol, which is another island, for a respite away from all this rain. It was the only island Bohol.

Is that the same as Bohol?

Bohol. Yeah. Okay. I stayed at Paradise. It was like a tropical oasis, this eco resort that we found. I stayed with Denise, who's like my right-hand lady here, and it's just magical. And I never wanted to leave. And it was sunny every day, all the time.

And then I came back right to the rain. It's tough around here.

You've been all over. If you've been down there, how many islands have you been on?

Well, just to, like the last time I was here, I've done a lot on this island on my trips, but Bohol I went to last time. And luckily my team took me to every tourist thing that you could do. I swam with the whale sharks, which was like life-altering. I saw all the things, the Chocolate Hills. This time I felt like I didn't have to do anything. We rented a boat one day and went snorkeling, but that was the only thing I did when I was there. Otherwise I hung out by the pool reading a book of fiction, which I never do, but I've challenged myself to.

Okay. So I have so many questions and unfortunately the Philippines, I could ask you a question about all day, but the one that I'm really burning on is last time we talked, well, last time we did a podcast before you actually went on this epic trip, which you're coming up on a month now, are you not?

When I get home, it'll be a month since I've seen my house, but I've seen my family 3 weeks ago. And because we went on vacation right before I left straight from vacation, but the most important person that I miss, I mean, I love my family so much, but it's my nephew. I miss him so much. And you know, they grow so fast.

He's going to look different for sure, but that's cool. That'll be a good experience. But you had taken time off from work to try and like sabbaticalize and recoverize and all the other things you needed to do. And it just wasn't going perfect. Like, in fact, with the, uh, off balance, we talked about that on the podcast, the vertigo and everything. You weren't like having this wonderful sabbatical. Like it wasn't going great.

I call it a sabbatical, which makes it sound like planned event in which I'd rediscover life or something. It was really like I could not work anymore. It was 2 months and I thought it would give my brain time to reset or something, 'cause I was either burned out, there's just a lot going on. But honestly, I still felt pretty much the same after those 2 months and making the decision to come here, I almost wondered if it was going to kill me because I didn't trust my mind or my body at that point.

I was legitimately worried. Traveling, it's different for other people, and I know you're different than me, but for me, traveling is very mentally heavy and emotionally it's tough to be away from my home for a while. When I'm away from my family for more than 3 or 4 days, it starts to tax me. But being away from home is also really hard too, which I guess it always comes in a package for me. But the point is, is that I was worried about where you were at physically, mentally, emotionally. We didn't ever dive into it, but you had talked about going on like a You'd use the term drugs.

I took drugs, Curt, but it was a spiritual medicine journey.

And with all that, I'm like, I don't know if this is a great idea for Melody to do this. But you texted me relatively shortly after you got to the Philippines and you're like, I'm okay. So tell me a little bit about this, like, pendulum swinging.

So first of all, I planned my travel really, really well. I bought something called Fly Kit, which is a bunch of supplements and different things that you take so that you won't have Jet lag. They also have an app and it tells you exactly when to sleep, when to put on your blue light glasses, when to take the supplements. It starts the day before and it ends so that you basically don't lose, you know, any days. And then I bought something also called a Firefly, which is a recovery kit for like, it basically zaps your, a place near your knee that helps you to circulate blood 300% more than you normally would. And athletes use it to recover.

I need this.

You actually would be perfect for this. I'm going to send you a link for this because it really does work. Like, I was afraid that I would struggle with that. I'd set myself up so that I would have the best possible outcome. I followed it religiously when I was on the flight, but I had a 4-hour or 5-hour delay when I was in Japan on a stopover, and it kind of messed up the flow of the whole thing because I was supposed to be sleeping during that time. And yet I still did not have jet lag. So that was crazy. I bought a kit for international travel, so I'll do it on the way home as well.

So I felt really good about that. I felt like I'd prepared, I traveled well, I took care of myself. And then when I got here, I took a couple of days. I'm at my favorite hotel, the Henry Hotel in Manila, which is oasis in a concrete jungle. Then I took the bus to the mountains. Manila's super hot, mountains are not. And when I was in the mountains, I stayed at a hotel that had free pressure acupuncture clinic, which I thought it was a spa because the way that they put the sign, it looked very fancy.

And you sent me the sign and it did look like a spa.

Yeah. It looked like they were selling services. I don't think I would've gone if I knew it was a free clinic because I would've felt really bad, like I'm wasting resources.

Here's this person coming from this really rich land trying to take advantage. Yeah, I wouldn't have liked that feeling.

But when I got there, they were like, nope, everybody's welcome. You know, invite anybody. They had this Korean doctor that they had brought in and it was sponsored by the Rotary Club. And so I'm up for anything usually. And I definitely, I've had acupuncture before. It really helped me when I did it. But I didn't know what to expect. I did not expect how painful it would be though, because they did both treatments.

The Korean doctor, I say Korean doctor, 'cause I feel like they have a special way of doing acupressure. I told him I have a brain problem, 'cause you have to tell them what the problem is. And I was like, I have so many problems, but let's start with brain. And he looked at me and he looked in my eyes and he said, you don't have no brain problem. You have a muscle issue. I'm like, what? He said, muscle issue, not brain problem. I'm like, okay, cool. Well, solve my muscle issue then.

He proceeded to do the most painful work. Do you know this muscle that masks, what is it called?

I don't know about the muscle, but you're pointing to where I know about the carotid artery. And a lot of bad things can happen in the carotid artery area.

Yeah. That's not it though. There's a huge muscle that travels from here all the way down to our toes.

And you say here, so people who are listening, it's the like Below the earlobe, you're going down the side of your neck.

Down the side of your neck. And it's like, for me, because of all the window cleaning, it's really big. Like this is not moving just because when you're doing this forever, like it's trained to be in that position. As he told me, he said, Filipina women have this big, pointing, making a little gesture. And then he said, you have this big.

Uh, cool. Thanks.

Yeah. Thank you. Just like the time the podiatrist told me I have the feet of Fred Flintstone because they're so flat.

Wow.

I thought it was hilarious. Good thing I'm not easily offendable. But trust me, I have told that story probably hundreds of times now because I think it's so funny.

That's awesome.

But he proceeded to just do a lot of manipulation of this muscle, my neck, and then work his way in my feet.

What about the acupuncture? Did he put needles in?

Well, that was the second part of the treatment and a different doctor did that. They had a whole thing going on. But after the first time he did it, and by the way, he's doing it in front of a room full of Filipino women and men who are all staring at you because it's not just a clinic, it's like a school or a seminar kind of thing going on, right? No, no, it was at a hotel that I was staying at in one of like a suite or a room that they had set aside, conference center maybe. So everybody was in the waiting room and he was doing some of his treatments in the waiting room and he did his treatment on me in the waiting room. And he seemed to take pleasure in the pain somehow. Yeah.

I've been to one of those.

When he was done, I felt for the first time in a long time clear in my head, in my brain, like really clear. I had not felt that way probably, it's been years, but definitely a good 9 months to 12 months for sure.

Wow.

Long time. Then I went and did needles after that. And that was a different thing, but it was amazing to me. You know, Curt, I've experienced things with different types of medicine or different modalities where I've had great relief and they're not usually normal.

Like you pop a pill and you're feeling better now.

Yeah, exactly. And then he said, come back tomorrow. I said, okay.

You're like, you tell me what to do. I will do more of this. Like, this is working.

I'm like, maybe this will actually work. Now, meanwhile, I'm also going and getting massages every day that I can. Almost every day I got a massage. It's very inexpensive here. And somebody had once told me, if you must get a massage 30 days in a row, which I've never done, you will experience like your body will release all of the suffering and trauma and all the things like that's when you start to be able to do deeper work. Now, I kind of believe in that. But I've never been able to have the money or the time to do that sort of deep work. But when I'm here, I'm like, I'm just going to do it.

Or people will come to your hotel and do it.

The best you can.

Yeah. So like he was doing that, but I was also trying to move it forward by doing the massage. Next day, even more painful, but again, I felt very clear. And then he said, come back tomorrow. And so I went back for a 3rd day. And by the way, I was becoming like BFFs with the people in the waiting room. It was really fun.

Because they're all coming back every day too?

They were all coming back every day too. Getting relief, you saw people who had canes or crutches, or some people had no problems, some had big problems. The interesting thing is that he universally told everybody that I heard, including me, a couple things. One is, of course, lose weight in your belly. Everybody has to lose weight in their belly. So don't eat, you know, sugar and carbs or whatever. Basically, sure, that, he's a doctor, of course. But then the second part is you have to use a very firm pillow and sleep at an angle that is not natural to me, but he said that will solve your problem.

So I'm only half-heartedly taking that to heart, but I will use a firm pillow.

Did you buy the pillow?

No, I did actually, I do have a pillow. It's one of the VAs that I placed with my brother's company. She knows I'm obsessed with Julian, my nephew, and she had a pillow made with his face on it and it's like this big. It's huge. And it became the mascot for this retreat with my team. So that's the pillow I have. Anyway, after those 3 days, I felt really, really good. But I've also experienced this before where I've had treatments where I felt really transformed and it's usually temporary.

And so that kind of is what happened. I never went back to fully just out of it. I've still maintained that some clarity. But I was here also to go to a conference, software conference for HighLevel. The first class that I was in, and there were thousands of people there, I didn't know it was going to be that big. My brain just shut down. So I had to leave and I didn't go back. But I had friends who were there as well.

So I would visit my friends, talk to some people, but I made my team go take notes so that we could talk about it later. But I never went back to learn anything because that was a trigger for me. And that has been a trigger with all my travel. If I'm in a room and it's noisy or there's a lot of going on, my brain can't handle it. Did I tell you I am getting brain scans in September?

You did tell me that. Let me ask you though, timeline didn't shift on us here. This is after you had met with the doctors and had the treatments and everything else. So this shutdown was, was like triggered outside of that.

Yeah. A couple of days after when I wouldn't get back to Manila. And I went to that conference. And the reason I left also is because I knew I had 2 days of work with my team after that, and I wanted to have a brain for them. I knew I wouldn't if I actually stayed in that conference. And honestly, for these conferences, it's a lot of marketers marketing, and I really don't like it. So, yeah, such a cynical person.

Are they selling from the stage the whole time?

They're selling themselves from the stage in a way. And there are a couple people who are really earnest and they are doing it and they I have a few friends who are really inspirational, but this is what I always don't like. And I wish I could be more like that of just marketing yourself as an authority when they're not always. You don't get on the stage because you're the smartest in the room. You know, that's not the way it always works.

I know, I know. It's a multitude of factors, but competence is only one minor consideration.

It is. Yeah. So anyway, the point is I didn't really miss much. They learned a lot, which was great. But it also helped them to understand some of the things I've been teaching them all along because they were seeing it in real life. I'm being vague.

So did you save your brain? Did it work?

Yeah, I did. And then we had 2 days. It was really like 3 days, but we had 2 days where we really went deep into what's going on with our company, where these bottlenecks are. And you know how you can get stuck in data and analysis mode? I was listening to a podcast. An MIT professor was talking about what he calls vibe analytics, which is making sure that whatever AI is giving you is going to be actionable insights only instead of just more stuff to wade through. See, it wants to take you all over the place. And even if you're trying to train it to stay focused, you really can go off on someplace in different directions. So I'm glad I listened to that because it allowed me to create a prompt that helped me to focus in.

I had a lot of meetings that I recorded with my team. We did a lot of resetting of things. And tomorrow I'm leaving the Philippines and I have a lot of work over the next 10 hours to 12 hours to pull this all together.

Are you flying nonstop home or do you have—

No. So I'm going to spend 3 days in Japan. That I'm worried about, actually.

That's right. How did I forget about that? That's like so cool.

It'll be— I'm nervous. I haven't been to a country that I didn't speak the language in some way in a long time. And it's like, I'm going to be in Tokyo. That's a city. So I'm sure I'll be fine. But you know, before you travel and it's been a while, you get nervous.

Yeah. Well, I'd be nervous currently to go to Tokyo for the reasons that you said, as far as like, I don't have any way of communicating. If they don't know English, I'm dead.

Google Translate. That's how people do it. Google Translate.

But it's not even just that, like culturally they are definitely different.

Yes. And that's the other concern. I don't want to offend anybody, and I am sure to offend somebody when I'm in Tokyo.

Yeah, like, what if they see the sole of your shoe, you know? Or I don't know, like, I'm not even sure what—

see, now I have another thing to worry about.

Well, I don't know if that's a thing in Japan. I just know that, like, I've heard, like, oh, you point at something with your finger, you know, oh my gosh, you know, like, anyway.

I'm planning on doing a deep dive right before. I did some research beforehand, but now that it's happening, I'm gonna be, like, really in Putting my brain deep into it so that I don't forget these things. And also it's probably not going to matter at all because that's the way it goes.

What is your flight itinerary then? So you leave for Japan tomorrow?

Yeah. And then I arrive at 4:00 AM. So I have like 3 full days and I'm going to muscle through it because I'm in Japan and this is my one shot and I don't care if I'm tired. And then on Friday I'm flying home and I'll get home at like 6:00 PM and same day, And then I go back to my regular life and it's going to be weird because I forgot that I'm really good at traveling. I'm really good at being in the world. And then I go home and there is something about home. It's comfortable, but also I don't want to always be comfortable, you know, and we can forget when we're home that there's a much bigger universe out there.

Yeah. I love being comfortable at home. I try hard not to travel. Even though I have, you know, a few times, but like, I get it. I do. I really do get it. Traveling does open your eyes. Now let me ask you, so I flew to Arizona from the Philippines and I went across the Pacific Ocean.

There's not a chance that it's faster for you on the East Coast to go the other way, is it?

No, I think it's faster for me to not go the other way. Last time I flew to Abu Dhabi and then the time before that it was Singapore. No, actually I did fly through Canada to Vancouver and that out that way. And it took me about 13 hours to get to Japan and then another 4 to the Philippines.

So your flight home will be going over the Pacific. You have any layovers?

No, just Japan.

So Japan straight home to, I guess, Washington, D.C. Where do you fly into?

Massachusetts, Curt. Massachusetts.

I know it's all the same to me, but like, what's your Massachusetts airport? Boston?

Boston. Yeah. So yeah, I fly straight there. Usually I do points for my trips and this time I'm like, no, the business is paying for this and I'm keeping my points for myself. Good for you.

So how long of a flight is that crossing the entire continental United States too?

Like 13 hours. Not too bad. I mean, but I fly business class.

Wait, that's not possible.

From Japan.

I guess Japan is a little bit closer, but I flew from, it was 13 hours to go from San Francisco to Cebu.

Straight?

Yeah.

Yeah. So I go 13 hours to Japan and then 4 hours to the Philippines from there. So maybe I thought it was 13 hours, but I'm pretty sure it's 13 hours.

That's a long day on the plane. I was thinking you were going to say it was closer to like 17, which is brutal.

No, that was when I flew to Abu Dhabi. It was like 16 hours and then it was another 4 hours from there. All right.

International lady of business. What are you even doing having an international employee business?

I know. Honestly, Curt, I didn't even know why I was coming here. I did not plan. I just knew I had to come here because I have not been here in almost a year and a half. I have a team. They need to see us sometimes and Zoom doesn't cut it all the time, and especially not for me. But it's so different working with people in a room than it is when you're on Zoom or you're working in Slack or whatever. And I needed that.

I needed to get in the room because the whole idea of my business has been feeling overwhelming. Understanding what we're even doing felt overwhelming. And at the same time, they weren't leaderless, but they were on their own course without me. And then we did grow when I was gone for the first time. Usually when I leave for periods of time, we don't grow. This time we did. So that was great. We just needed to be together.

We needed to reset. And I also have a friend here who has a really large agency that she's built. And I went a couple times to her agency to see what she's done. It was so inspiring to see how she's built this place. They have medical facilities. They give free lunches in these beautiful lunchrooms. They have nap rooms and karaoke room and these training centers. It was just like, if I had a dream agency that I could build, that would be the one.

It's a $60 million agency. Yeah, it's a big deal. And she was kind enough to take me on a tour in exchange for some corn tortillas that I brought her from America. She asked for them. She's American. That's the one thing you can't get here.

So anyway.

I was kind of going on faith and it was very blind faith. I really felt like it was unsustainable what I was doing before. And I think I've talked pretty openly about how I was feeling about my business. I mean, that's part of my journey more recently. But being here really has restored my spirit in ways that I don't think would have been restored otherwise. And it's just helped me to reengage in what we're doing. But I also recognize that I can't do what I was doing before. It's not sustainable for me as a human.

So with it not being sustainable and you having made this trip, what is now sustainable? What changed? Well, wait, wait, sorry. Did I make the correct assumption that now it is sustainable what you've done?

If I go back to just working 40 hours a week, it's not going to work for me. So there was a couple of things that I needed to do. One, I have an amazing salesperson. She is naturally gifted. We don't get enough prospects for her to be selling all the time, and that's a problem that we've been working on. But the other part of it is that I don't like salespeople. Like, I don't like the way they sell. And so I wanted her— There are certain rules I had for her that were really confining for her, but I didn't also understand that she wasn't showing me her full personality for this past year because she was afraid of getting fired.

A lot of Filipinos have what I call boss trauma, and she had had an experience where she was her full self, which is maybe more— not pushy, but she's more confident and outgoing and direct than a lot of Filipinos might be. And she kind of got kicked out of her last job because other people didn't like that about her. And this time she really felt like she needs this job, of course, but also she likes my company. And since we work directly together, she really felt a lot of pressure to please, even though that's the exact opposite of what I want. And what that did is it created a trust deficit because I could feel that there was something that wasn't right. And so as soon as we got in the room together and I saw her personality, I was like, what have you been doing? Why have I not seen this part of you? Like, we went out to sing karaoke one night, best night of my life while I was here. Well, one of them, because I really felt the urge to sing. I really needed to sing.

So we rented a room at this place and I was just like, guys, I just have to sing a lot of songs. Luckily, there were 2 people who did not sing most of the time, so that allowed me to sing more. But then my salesperson, Angela, was like, well, do your thing because once you give me the mic, you're not getting it back.

Oh, wow.

Yeah, but it was great. I love that. And so what it allowed me to do is to trust her. Like, she used to sell for Amex, and she was really good at it. She was award-winning at that. And the reason she left is because the way that they compensated changed. But she's a very unique salesperson because she's not looking for the commissions. She just has that drive to like win, but she also loves being on a team.

So that's a very unique position for a salesperson to be in. So that was huge for me because basically I said to her, go do what you do. The only thing I care about is making sure that you don't sell something that the team can't deliver because it screws them over. But that was a very big thing for me to let go of and to hand over to her. We have a coaching group that I've been paying for her to be in. So that also helps that I trust them to guide her. as well. Being with Denise for 2 and a half weeks in a row, she's my ops manager, but she's also been with me the longest.

And, you know, even after all this time, we didn't even kill each other. She feels like a daughter and a sister and a mother all wrapped into one. Oh, wow.

That's quite a mixture.

But she's my daughter's age, so she can be very wise and also childlike. But being with her really allowed me to get the time to just figure out what she's been managing, what's been happening on her side. So that happened with all my employees, is I had time with them and was able to have one-on-ones, get to know them better, also, you know, coach them, find out what their dreams are, the stuff that I don't really have the energy or time to do on a Zoom call.

And it is different when you're there in person. Did you go there with like a really heavy agenda in terms of—

Zero agenda. I just knew that we were going to do—

Just got in the same room and— Let the chips fall where they may.

People don't like it when you do that. But what I did know is we would have those 2 days of GHL, you know, the conference, and then we would have the 3 days after. And I had a feeling that I would know what I needed to do after the conference. And I did. And so we really actually did pretty well given the time that we had.

So when you're coaching one person, what's happening with the rest of the people?

They're working on other things. Like, they're working night shift. So I worked the shift last night so that I could do one-on-ones with everybody. They're already back home. You know, they left, you know, after the couple days, but I wanted to make sure I ended the trip with making sure that I had all the information I needed to be able to guide us on the next part and kind of give an overview. It's hard to talk about it because as you know, when you're doing a big project and you're using AI for that project, I'm recording everything. So I've got tons of transcripts. I've got documents that we've been using or creating.

And all of that has to go in and then you have to figure out what the output should be. And I can't always describe what the output I want is because I don't know what I'm missing. So I go through with AI on it, but sometimes you can end up on crazy side paths that you didn't intend to be on a lot of times. And I'm trying to avoid that. So my goal is when I leave here tonight, they're going to have the guide moving forward of how we're going to, you know, what we're focused on. I changed our quarterly goals to monthly goals because I think we need to move faster and getting back to our KPIs because it's really easy to let go of KPIs when people aren't paying attention. Even though we're doing our L10 meetings, some of them didn't work anymore. And then, you know, things started to slide.

So we did a reset.

Okay. So you worked the night shift, your brain was healed with only one minor little thingy bopper. How are you holding up? With the schedule that you're keeping and the intensity that you're keeping? Because I'm doing pretty good, but listening to you has made me quite tired, actually.

I feel like I relaxed a lot in the beginning of the trip. I front-loaded relaxing and just acclimating. I thought it was also going to be time for thinking, but I wasn't very clear yet on what that meant until after the magic healer came into my life.

Okay.

Yeah. But once I was, you know, with the team and we started doing the conference, I'm really good at dialing in when I need to. So it all kind of came to me. I've learned to trust myself. I don't know about you, Curt, but I've really learned to trust myself that I do find the answer. And usually it comes a lot closer to the deadlines than I would like, but that's when my brain tends to work best.

You like to work under pressure. Unfortunately, I do. I wish it wasn't that way. And I do think there's a bit of procrastination that makes the mother of necessity the Necessity is the mother of all invention. I have found that mother necessity has turned me into a good last-minute worker.

I actually am okay with it. I used to stress about it a lot when I was younger, and now I just understand that's the natural flow of my energy. And so, as Denise said to me today, I don't even know what day it is. Yesterday I was working in the day and she's like, wait, you want us to work all day and then all night? I'm like, we just had so much break at the end of the trip. This is how I work. This is how I operate. I didn't make her work all day and all night, but I do that when I know the pressure's on. My brain opens up and I just get stuff done.

I'm going to get through Japan and then I will crash for a week when I get home, I'm sure.

Yeah, probably. Well, I'm not at the top of my game, but I'm pretty high up there. And honestly, I don't know. I don't know if I could do what you're doing. Like, it's— you're working at a pretty high intensity with pretty long hours.

Yeah, I haven't been doing that the whole time.

I know, I know. It's been about 5 days though, right? Like, you're 5 in.

I went to Bohol, I went to the island and had a couple days where I was working less. I don't even know if I opened my computer. And then I came back and I've been hustling ever since. So the thing is, it is really confusing. People here, they work nights all the time. And I don't know how they do it, Curt. I really don't know how, because it's just a really unnatural way to live. And yet they do it because they can make good money.

They can work from home. There's like a lot of benefits to it, but people tend to get sick a lot when they're working on that schedule. There can be mental health issues and not everybody can hack it.

Yeah. I have a Filipino contractor that moved to Canada and now he's in my time zone, but he's in Canada. He was always so sick in the Philippines and he's always still sick now. It's like, I'm always like, man, you are sick a lot. We've had a few conversations and he's like, yeah, I've just always been a sickly person. So I don't know. I went there and got sick with the water.

I haven't this time. I did not get sick. I'm very proud of myself.

Yeah, you should because it's no joke. Like the American belly, as they say, doesn't do really well there. So I thought maybe their belly just isn't as strong as mine, but not like invincible. And, but no, I think you're right. There might be something to the schedule. I don't know. One of the things that I find interesting though about this, like Filipinos working at night thing is that I live in Arizona and it's hot this time of year.

So hot.

And one of the things that I wish is that we would be nocturnal like all the animals here because I would very much enjoy 100 degrees in the sun versus 100 degrees after the sun's gone down. It's not even comparable. It's still warm for sure. And, you know, I don't want my house 100 degrees even when the lights are out. I'm not trying to say anything about that. All I'm saying though, is, is that you don't have to be acclimated to Arizona to feel the difference between 100 in the sun versus not. I was like, man, maybe we should become nocturnal, but I need the whole US to go in on it with me in order for that to work.

But then also you'd just be working in your office.

Well, yes, but on the weekends I'd love to be able to do stuff outside. You know, for example, you know, we just went out on the river and did a trip and We were only out from like 7:00 AM till like noon. You know, we don't need sunscreen because we're going to be done by noon. And I didn't burn, but my wife, my daughter, her husband, just my other son, they just got so cooked like crabs. And I'm like, wow, that's pre-noon. The high burn time doesn't even start till 1:00.

I got pretty burned the other day when we went snorkeling. I forgot to sunscreen a couple areas, including my face. And my face was like a lobster. Usually I have summer sun. I don't get like that.

You don't look like a lobster right now at all.

'Cause I put on some makeup.

But snorkeling, you also have your face in the water. I always got my back burnt, not my face when you're snorkeling.

My back is also was burnt and my legs were burnt in the back 'cause that's where I forgot to put sunscreen on. I was just like not paying attention and I know better. I know better, but I survived and it didn't even hurt in the end, which was interesting. I think it's because I got a massage that night 'cause I thought it might be the last one I could get because I'd be having, you know, a burn. But I think they massaged the burn away. They used aloe vera on me.

Oh, I was gonna say, yeah, aloe vera could change the whole game. I've had bad burns. You put aloe vera on fast enough and—

Yeah, but Curt, it's been crazy here. It's rainy season, flooding every day, and people in this city, especially in Manila, this is where most of my time has been spent. When I went to visit my friend Courtney at her agency, what should have been a 20-minute trip turned into 2 hours because of traffic, just In the rain. And my meeting was supposed to be at 11 and I got there, I think at midnight because we're on nighttime, you know, the nighttime, which was also weird to go to a business meeting at midnight. And then I got home at like 4:30 in the morning and it took me 20 minutes to get home. So it's just crazy how much traffic plays into people's lives here too. Flooding. I mean, have you ever had one of your employees say, I can't work because my house is flooded?

So today we had Curt, I can't meet with you because my internet just went out. And I was like, what? And like, yeah, our electricity went out 2 hours ago. Electricity came back. I couldn't get the internet. So I'm using my cell, but I'm out of, almost out of data. So we've had that. When I was there, I have had an employee say, I left my computer downstairs and downstairs flooded while I was asleep upstairs. And I didn't know that until I got home and I got to dry my computer up.

Like, what? You start hearing these stories that are very commonplace that don't like really shock anyone who lives in there in the area. Visiting, I went during September, which is still typhoon season, which a typhoon is the same as a hurricane. Just, I guess it spins the opposite way. But when I was there in Cebu, this flood just came through. The kids all come out, they're pushing cars. They're having a great time because your car's exhaust is going underwater and they're just having a ball, just freeing people, pushing them. And you got the little 3-wheeled, um, the tuk-tuks, tuk-tuks. Anyway.

So yes, I have had like the experience of them telling me, and then I've also been there and seen it. And there is a thing that I kind of wanted to get to in this conversation. Maybe we're here now. Being in that culture, which is so different than your own, you know, there's a certain part of you that's like chasing AI and the newest technologies and how do we get more efficient and how do we use our cell phones more? And then you get amongst these people who live so much more simply. And you're like, do they have this figured out? Like, what are we even trying to get away from? You know, now I love my house being dry. I love the air conditioning that runs and keeps it nice and cool. I love the conveniences that I am afforded by the infrastructure of where I live. I mean, I don't want to be too trite about this, but the question I wanted to get to is like, as you're among the people of the Philippines with all of the inconveniences that kind of come along, what have your thoughts been around just overall happiness?

I did make a video about the rain for people who have VAs just to understand from a different perspective, because it is hard when you're in the States and hearing these stories over and over to not think, okay, is this for real? But it is for real. But I'm always amazed that people here, they don't stress about it the way that we would in America. Like it's just normal life and they go through it with a smile on their face most days. And I'm not saying that— I know it sounds like I'm the American coming in and making judgments about this population. I mean, I'm sure there's a lot of sad people among them as well, but it's so commonplace. It's the norm. And it's true. I've lived in countries where I lived very simply and we really don't need a lot.

I will also say, Curt, they have some of the most enormous, gorgeous malls here full of every store. They have more KFCs here than they do in the States. I swear to God, just in Manila. Jollibee's.

Jollibee's. Oh, so much Jollibee's.

The headquarters of Yankee Candle is where I am in Massachusetts, and they have one in the mall here. So it's just anything that you can get in America, you can get here just as easily. It might cost as much as it does in the States, but I guess what I'm saying is like, there is simple living and then there's also aspirational living happening here as well. I don't even know if America has middle class anymore either.

Well, one thing I was surprised by is that when I was in Cebu, I got around, like they love their malls. And honestly, I think a lot of people are escaping the heat and going to the mall and the malls know, like, we got a captive audience, but the cars there, like take the jeepneys out, jeepneys, a lot of them, like those little buses that are old, but they're like all also like souped up and like they do all sorts of kind of crazy stuff with them. But the cars themselves, the owner-operator ones, they all seem to be like new.

I was just in one today. I'm like, is this a new car? It was so nice and beautiful. And he's like, no, it's 3 years old.

But like all less than 10 years old, like easy.

There are a lot of cars here that seem newer. I will say that I don't see a lot of cars that are older, and I'm sure there's a reason for that. I'll ask Denise later, but it never occurred to me. I, for instance, I remember when I was in Morocco living there, everybody had a Mercedes from the '70s. Those were all the taxis. It was like, it just seemed really funny to me that this like fancy Mercedes was the thing that everybody just got around in. They were huge. But that's not how it is here.

I think the jeepney is the Mercedes of the Philippines.

Yeah, maybe. But I just, I felt like, like I have older cars, like I don't buy new cars.

I have a very old car. Yeah.

I take care of them and I, you know, keep them up. But it's like, dang, all these people who are living in houses that, you know, obviously with floods, they don't like have a lot of incentive to get their house up to 100% because it's going to flood again. You know, so you're looking, you're like, well, they're living like this, so obviously their car's probably going to be lower end and probably a bit more beat up. But I didn't see anyone getting in crashes. I never saw any beat up looking cars. I never saw a car that was older than like 10 years old, like mostly newer than 5. And I'm like, all right, so cars are the thing here. You know, I don't know where all the older cars are going.

I don't know either. I also don't know how anybody affords it because cars are expensive.

And motorcycles are so superior as far as getting around, I think. I mean, I didn't ride on one either. Like you said, you hadn't, but they can just zip through where cars are stuck.

Yeah, they can. And they do, they do zip through. I've asked Denise and I've asked my team a lot of questions because I just don't understand how people live. Like I had to go to the mall to buy Crocs because the sandals I brought were slippery. And every day, if you're walking in rain, you can't have slippery sandals. So I went and they were more expensive than it would've been in the States even to buy them there.

They have to import.

Yeah. But it imports from China. It's right over there. Like I'm closer. You know what I'm saying?

Yeah. Well, I knew I saw Nike and Adidas are extremely popular and both Nike and Adidas were far more expensive there. And I think, you know, they're like, yeah, we're going to pay the American premium.

It might be the brand also, like you're paying for brand, but I just don't understand how people live or how they shop at the mall or how they afford to eat at the restaurants. It's not much cheaper. It's not like it's so much less cheap, but I also think I'm kind of underestimating how expensive America is now.

Yeah, because I did find their food to be far cheaper and their transportation, like getting a Grab, like that's their Uber. A Grab is nothing. Their flights are nothing. Their food, I found their food to be extremely reasonable.

I will say though, that since the last time I was here, flights are more expensive. I paid a lot more for my flight to Bahal than I did, you know, this time than I did last time. Of course it was last minute, but still it was a lot more expensive, like 4 times more. And even taking away half of that being for last-minuteness, it's still because of the war. fuel reserves here the way that they've been rationing at times even. I think food is more expensive than I remembered it being before. And transportation, it depends on the time of day, but usually it's cheaper. I took a sleeper bus where they have beds in the bus.

I thought that might be more comfortable for the trip to Baggio. It was not actually, because not just 2 lines, it's like they put a 3rd aisle In an average standard bus because Filipinos are small people and they just squashed people in. And it was kind of like, it was very claustrophobic. I ended up sitting at the front of the bus. I didn't freak out or anything, but I was standing and she was like, do you want to come to the front? And then I just was like hanging out with the driver. So that was more fun for me. But yeah, it's interesting. Services are not expensive here, but I find that food items and things like that are more expensive than they were before.

Okay. Well, it's good to know. It's good to know.

Still more affordable than the States though, Curt.

Well, thanks for sharing that with me because it's good to know where my friend's been and you're safe and your brain's doing great.

No, I wouldn't say— I'd say it's okay. It's way better, but I just still think there has to be something going on because I still have things like going to that conference where I just felt like I couldn't think. I started stuttering again. Which is a symptom of when I had my concussion. So yeah, it was very upsetting to me because when that happens, that's my signal when my eyes don't see as well. So it might be that my muscles are part of the problem, but I still think something's going on with my brain and I'm so excited for my brain tests because I love data.

As long as it's actionable data. Well, right on. I'm so happy for you.

Thank you. I was going to ask, do you think you're coming back here ever?

Oh, definitely I am. I don't have it planned right now. I'm due. I will tell you that I'm not, not in a frame of mind for it right now. I wish I could explain it to you more. I would love to be able to explain to myself more. For me, staying home is the right move for now. And I know I'm more comfortable.

It'll always probably feel like the right move, but I very much enjoy the Philippines. I really do want to go back. I just couldn't do it right this second. Now, if you asked me next month, that's probably enough time for things to change where I could feel differently. But I will say that right now with the amount of stuff that we've got going on in the company, I feel a lot of momentum right now. And I feel like there's a lot of company culture work that is needing to be done, but there's some things that I would like to go and celebrate in the Philippines and not go there and talk about it.

Yeah. Well, that's my next trip. I'm hoping to come back in 6 months. I would love to bring my family. I think they're due. So if I can afford it, I want to drag them along. They'll love it. But I also am wanting to invite clients if they want to come and do a couple of days, you know, with their VAs.

And because I think a lot of people who have virtual assistants talk about wanting to come, but it's like a lot to put that together, you know, for themselves. So that's something that is on my radar for next time. doing an event here for people and for VAs, but we haven't really started that planning process and 6 months might not be enough time. But the kind of event I would do would not be like a ResponsiCon type thing. It would be a very low-key, let's get to know your VA and fix some of the problems if there are some and, you know, move forward, but not as much of like a conference or anything.

You feel like you have to do something big and extravagant if you're gonna go out and do it. Where maybe just figuring out what's— forget about big or figure out extravagant, what would be the most meaningful thing? And then just wonder if like, if that would be what we need to do.

I know another company that the founders, they bring their clients to the Philippines once a year, whoever wants to come. And I think that's a great experience for people, you know, like a cultural experience, a vacation that you can expense. It is a far flight, but it's worth it.

Yeah, I think that's another message for anyone who does hire people internationally and work with teams like that. There's a ton of value in breaking bread with someone, or if you can sing karaoke, that actually is probably more powerful than even that.

It could be. Can I tell you what I'm going to do in Japan? I have one goal when I'm there. The goal is to learn a Japanese song and sing it at karaoke. I don't know how I'm going to do that.

Yeah. There's so much because you got the words, the timing, and then like, I always worry about saying a word that's just very close to the right word, but it totally messes it up.

Well, I've already tested my method and what I've done is asked AI to make it phonetically because I'm sure it'll be in Japanese on the screen, but I'm going to phonetically spell it out on my phone is my goal. It may or may not happen.

Yeah. I was just going to say, I think there are some pronunciations that we don't have a way to do it.

Yeah, but do you know how cool it is when people at least try? Like when you hear people speak English, like we're selfish, we think everybody should speak English, but when you hear somebody who's like, I'm sorry, I don't speak good English, but they speak great English, like they're even trying, that's huge. That takes a lot of courage.

I actually totally respect someone who comes in and like, it's really hard to hear what they're saying, but like, dang, you're doing a lot more than I am right now.

Yeah.

And people sing English karaoke songs around the world, so I should try to sing one If you did Friends in Low Places there, I guarantee you they would be able to sing with you. It's the most popular karaoke song on this side of the Mississippi and this side of the Pacific and the other side of the Pacific. I'm just kidding. I don't know. It is a popular one.

I'll think about that one, but I did a lot of Filipino practice, so we'll see how it goes. I'll let you know next time. But yeah, next time I talk to you, I will be back home. And honestly, Curt, I might be in a slight state of travel depression. Because, you know, it is hard to acclimate. For me, at least, it's hard to reacclimate to life when I've been on the adventure for a while, but I'll get there.

Are you sure you don't want to record a podcast while you're in Japan?

That would be fun.

I would love it for me, but I can't even imagine what the pace you're going to be keeping that this is a good idea.

I have no idea, but yeah, we'll see.

Cool. Well, thank you, Mellody, and thank you everybody for joining us. It's been a great time catching up and You are thriving, lady. I love it.

This week I am thriving. Thank you, Curt. I'll talk to you. I don't know why I say I'll talk to you. That's a weird way to end something.

How about this? Melanie, it's been so good talking to you. I can't wait to hear from you again and hear how all your travels went.

And also unto you, Curt.

Thanks everybody for joining us at the Soul Proprietor Podcast. It has been an absolute pleasure having these discussions with you. If you wouldn't mind taking just a few minutes to rate and review us wherever it is that you listen to podcasts, it would mean so much to us. We really do read each of these reviews, and it gives us the opportunity to get the word out to more people who could benefit from hearing about topics like this and so many others. If you want to engage with us at our website and maybe share some topics or ideas of other people that you'd like to hear on the podcast, feel free to go to soulproprietorpodcast.com and share with us your thoughts and ideas about what we could do in the future to bring even more light into the world.